AL BOYD of IMPERIAL WONDERS

(part one)

Interview 3 October 2002

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(Acknowledgement to a piece by Al on the Soul Treasures Website used for research purposes)

Some of the guys are still around from the other groups but a lot of them have gone underground and I have no idea of how to contact them except to go back to Cleveland and do an Imperial Wonder re-union gig and I am sure a lot of friends and foes will come out of the woodwork. This idea is in my future agenda.

Larry Hancock is gigging at the Ritz Carlton in downtown Cleveland, Thursday, Friday, Saturday and Sunday. He's doing a one man lounge act with music background tracks.

Gus Hawkins (leader of S.O.U.L.) is also gigging downtown at a club.

Kenny Redd, guitar player, former member of 9th Street Exit is gigging around Cleveland in small clubs. He has a web site on the internet. Dunn Pearson, former member of 9th Street Exit still plays keyboards on and off with the O'Jays.

None of the other groups that I mentioned in the bio is doing anything except Cash who has a CD out and they have changed their name to Smooth Approach. I talked to Dennis Cash a couple of months ago and tried to give him a couple
of connections to help him promote his CD. I'm still waiting on him to send me a copy of his CD like he promised.

It's funny but a lot of groups in the Cleveland area who came out before and after the Imperial Wonders just totally gave up. Back in the day, when the scene in Cleveland was hot with groups, everybody was trying to be the next group to make it big like the O'Jays. Most of the problems was not the talent, but more poor business connections with either management or record labels. A lot of groups trying to compete with the Imperial Wonders were only
trying to do just that instead of moving away from Cleveland where they could have a good chance to make it.

The Dazz Band, formerly Kinsman Dazz, formerly Bell Telefunk are still travelling around the world doing gigs in the UK and Japan. Bobby Harris, the leader and sax player got the band back together and had a CD out last year and has a single out which is a remake of Starship by Norman Connors. Kenny Pettus, the tenor with the Dazz band, moonlights as a bouncer at nightclubs and works at Music stores. Someone told me he's become an excellent bass guitar player.

Way Out records no longer exist. The owner, Lester Johnson, passed away in the 70's or 80's and I hear that all his masters are in storage on Cedar Avenue in Cleveland.

Saru records died out shortly after the O'Jays and Bobby Massey parted from their organization.

S.O.U.L. wound up recording This Time round written by myself and Fred Butler and On Top Of The World written by myself and Walter Chaney after Porky (a local Clevelander who became famous for his book Gentleman of Leisure, The life of a Pimp) passed on the songs. I don't know why S.O.U.L. never went to another label after Musicor but I guess part of that can be blamed on the loss of Larry Hancock who at one time played keyboards but was replaced with several other keyboard players who could play as good as Larry could sing.

(I forgot to mention that former member of S.O.U.L., Beloyd was probably the most important member of the band besides Larry Hancock. He wrote songs such as THE JONES', THE ROPE-A-DOPE. After he left S.O.U.L. he became a member of Earth Wind & Fire for a brief stint where his vocal style influenced some
of Maurice White's vocals. He wrote a song for Earth Wind & Fire called GET AWAY. He is now a member of a band called. Wildfire that has other former Earth Wind & Fire members such as Roland Batiste.

I also forgot to mention a few other groups from Cleveland such as Mother Braintree, Scott Raven, Sexual Harassment, Marlene & the Debonettes, The Force Band, Evelyn Wright, Pearl Hampton, Rusty Wesson, Strange Fruit, Myla Burton and Leroy Simmons. )

Almost every group in Cleveland that had some record out could have or should have gone big-time. One group in particular ,The Rotations, had a setback after their first single Searching In Vain, flip side I Can't Find My Baby
when the two main lead singers Tommy and Joe were killed in a liquor store supposedly attempting a holdup which no body believes was the truth. This left Paul Robinson, the bass singer, Ernest, the first tenor and Roland without the two strongest vocalists. Paul and a guy named Howard Rice (brother of Donald Rice latter member of The Entertains after Larry Hancock had left) and a guy named Jimmy formed a group called The Epics who never recorded anything as the Epics because there was another group called The Epics which Ron Tyson of The Temptations belonged to.

The Elements who became Moving Violation, had gotten a nation wide label deal with Atco Records and had a single released called Wild Goose Chase . However, at the time the record was released the Miracles replaced Smokey Robinson with a lead singer named Billy Griffin who sounded like Mark Anthony of Moving Violation which killed them and I never heard of another released by them.

The Outtasites were a group created totally to dethrone The Imperial Wonders. Our former producer Lou Ragland ,who by the way is living in Las Vegas and just finished a stint with The Ink Spots which lasted for over ten years was producing the Outtasites( "I Can't Take It Baby") and their choreographer, a guy named Tony Wilson who is also their manager was an ex- rival of Avaughn Wells over a girl named Karen who Tony wound up marrying. The Outtasites
made a trip to California and broke up.

I ran into Bobby Wade at The Small Lounge in Ceasars just before he had to change the name from The Imperials to The Emperors. His first hit in Cleveland was Four Walls And A Window but he most loved in Cleveland for Blind Over You, his second release. He told me in LAs Vagas that he was thinking about retiring and just booking acts in Las Vegas
but I don't think he has thrown in the towel yet.

The Springers,who was lead by a guy by the name of Little Tyrone, wound up living that gentleman of leisure lifestyle and faded into the woodwork. My favorite song by them was "I Know Why" and "Why". " I Know Why " was a song that all the first tenors in the Ghetto had to be able to sing to be validated.

The Hesitations brought out "Soul Superman" and their biggest hit "Born Free" took them past the O'Jays back then. But they broke up after two of the members were playing with a gun and one of them was accidentally killed. The main lead singer, Blakely, married one of my classmates who lived on Crawford Road. I was invited to the reception by his wife's best friend Eunice. I haven't seen or heard from him since. That was around 1976.

The Pharaohs that you mentioned was not the group that Avaughn was a member of, or at least he was not in
it when the record that you mentioned was recorded. Avaughn told me about how one day when his group the Pharaohs were on the WJMO road show with us at the Club 105 in Cleveland, that they unplugged the P.A.system on us because we were so good right in the middle of our show.

There was two groups of Montclairs out there. The first one was called the Montclairs then they changed their name to Don Gregory and the Montclairs. Their first record that I know of was called "Pull Your Coat" which I am still trying to get a copy of and their local hit "Happy Feet Time". Their biggest hit in Cleveland was "You'll Wait For Me" which I have seen but put off buying because the price is something like $75.00 to $100.00 in U.S. currency. These songs were released in the '60s. This other group called the Montclairs came out in the '70s and were not from Cleveland.

My sister's group had out a record which I was able to buy a copy of called "Hole In Your Soul". It was released as A.C. Jones and the Soulettes. A.C. had another release before as A.C. Jones and the Atomic Aces. My sister's group only existed for one record because they broke up after my sister who was the leader of the Soulettes got pregnant and never followed up returning to music until recently with my other two sisters Barbara and Eloise. Barbara's son Brian also sing with them in St.Matthews Church in Cleveland. Brian has a real beautiful voice that was trained by my sister Barbara
who used to sing opera in Canada and Germany.

Sly, Slick and Wicked is another group that had someone come along a steal their name. The original Sly, Slick and Wicked was John Wilson, Terry Stubbs and Charles ?. The recorded under Jupar records (a motown subsidiary)and Shaker records when they recorded two of Avaughn's and my songs " Turn On Your Lovelight" and " We Don't Have To Be Lovers". They were on about five different labels before they stopped being a group. Then these other guys out
here in L.A. started using the name and released several LPs/CDs. I talked to John Wilson recently and he told me that he has taken the latter group to court and is awaiting a decision on who has rights to the name. He assures me that the Judge will rule in his favor.

Leon And The Burners played at the Red Carpet Lounge on Euclid in Cleveland for years then they recorded and broke
up. Walter Chaney and I used to go there every chance we could get when we weren't gigging because it was a good place to meet single women. Leon quit the group and went solo. I think that was his mistake because The group had more appeal to the ladies with the other members.

I didn't know the Ambassadors that well. I just met them once or twice and knew that anyone calling themselves singers had to go through them and some of the other groups I mentioned in my Bio such as Lou Ragland's Sahibs. Lou also had a pretty good career as a solo artist( "Never Let Me Go" which
I have a copy of)and with his group the original Hot Chocolate. You can find Hot Chocolate's LP on sale on the internet and Soul Brothers records. Also his solo album "The Conveyor" is out there too on the internet and Soul Brothers records.

I last saw Kim Tolliver here in L.A. at the Mint Lounge and I have a picture of myself, Russell and Leroy singing some Gladys Knight songs with her when we were booked together. Lou told me about how he and Kim Tolliver turned down Otis Reddings offer to fly with him to Detroit the night his plane crashed into the Great Lakes. The Imperial Wonders were At Leo's Casino the night after Otis left and we were on stage when the news came about the tragedy. One of the Barkays was at our show. He missed being on the plane because he met a girl who talked him into staying with her for a couple of days. He wound up reforming the Barkays that recorded after the crash(The Son OF Shaft).

The Imperial Wonders didn't really get a record out as the Imperial Wonders until Kennedy AKA Sonny Thompson quit. When Lester got into the group we became more business orientated because Lester was about seven years older than us and had a family. He was more serious about really doing this thing to make money more than the glamour and the girls and the parties (which we had some way out parties in our day). I used to write out the lyrics to the latest top ten songs that we were learning for the other guys who were not into putting their ears to speakers trying to figure out that one word or two that didn't come across clearly on record. Sometimes I had to create a word that seemed like it was what the artist was saying. Even today I trip when i hear an oldie that we used to do and because of the digital clarity today I hear what the artist was really saying. that kind of stuff lead to me writing my own lyrics after studying Smokey,Holland Dozier Holland,Gamble and Huff, Whitfield and Strong and Thom Bell,William Hart and Linda Creed.

I don't know if the Soul Merchants that you speak of is the same ones that I knew. Calvin Brown, a guitar player who was in the Band back in the '60s is out here in L.A. we have gigged together on the club circuit out here but for the most part I have graduated to another level of gigs while I hear that
Calvin still does some small clubs and plays in church with his new wife.

I haven't seen Ronnie Love in so long that he could be standing right next to me and I wouldn't know him.I saw Jimmy StClair about five years ago at a club in Cleveland. He still looks like the Lady killer we used to watch out for when we were on the sets together.

Bobby Dukes now calls himself Ismael. He was once being considered replacing Bobby Massey in the O'Jays. He had a dynamite voice and could dance circles around everybody and I do mean everybody on the set in Cleveland but he did not have the look the O'Jays were looking for, especially after William Powell was replaced by Sammy Strain. During the O'Jays 20th anniversary tour, which they took us(Truth) out with them, they let Dukes do the MC-ing on some shows and he sang the fourth voice in the back with the band. Now Dennis (Doc) Williams the band leader and keyboardist sings the fourth voice. Bobby Dukes and Cynthia Woodard a record a song for Shaker Records ( the O'Jays first
label) called " I'll keep Coming Back" and " If This Ain't Really Love" which I obtained a copy of recently. My friends out here in L.A. swear it should have been a smash but, as I've told you, sometimes it's about management or the labels ability to promote product.

The Soul Notes faded out after " How Long Will It Last?"and maybe one other cut. William Bell aka Bill Spoon the lead singer had a unique sounding voice. Lou Ragland is trying to do something on him in the studio even as we speak. Bill has been out here in L.A. longer than me. I 've been out here for a long stretch since 1980 (i spent 2 years back in Cleveland from 1987 to 1989 before returning) until now. I try to go back to Cleveland twice a year to visit family and friends.

The Sensations were a group that I respected and admired because they were coming with the real singing and the were following up their records every year until Way Out closed down.Their record "Baby Please Don't Go" was a love song that all of us younger groups were trying to do on our shows.Their last big song was "It's A New Day". I just recently purchased it too in my quest to obtain as many old 45s that had meaning to me as I can. I just recently found out that the Sensations were not from Cleveland , but were from Michigan. They just came into Cleveland to do their recordings and when they were through, they went back home.

There is still some Old School R&B in Cleveland but, the music scene all over the USA has changed for the younger generation because most record companies think that they will be buying most of the music made today. So a lot of stations cater to Rap and Hip Hop. Some stations are abandoning this format and are playing Oldies mixed with todays R&B.That's why I brought out Time Machine to let people know that Old School can still be done today and I will continue to record in this mode on my next new Imperial Wonders project.

The Imperial Wonders did start about 1963 but there was the Matadors, the Brown Beatles and Beatle Brooks and Co. before the Imperial Wonders. That was around 1960 or 1961. I thought I first saw Eddie Levert in person at Leo's Casino in 1967, when the Imperial Wonders were going to rehearse at Leo's but, we had to wait for the O'Jays to finish up. They were rehearsing "I Was Made To Love Her" by Stevie Wonder and I remember their choreography to this very day. I realized later that I had been having conversations with Eddie Levert at the corner store on 82nd and Cedar about
Marvel and DC comic book characters several times when we would be reaching for some of the same books like the Fantastic Four,Spiderman,the Hulk,Superman,The Flash,etc...I didn't know that at that time here I was talking to one of my favorite singers on a level with the Temptations to me. They always have been and always will be at the top of my list. Nobody could out perform Eddie Levert one on one on stage because he sang from the heart and did things that the entertainer in him brought out spontaneously. He just like the other greats never sang a song the same way twice. So if you're recording you'd better let the tapes roll cause you might miss a once in a lifetime riff. I still go to see them when they come to L.A. when i'm not doing a gig on that same night myself. I haven't caught them in a bout a year or two but I'm due to see them soon.

We recorded our first record as the Mints instead of The Imperial Wonders when Robert enlisted in the Army because Robert's mom owned the name.However she decided to relinquish the name The Imperial Wonders to me at a later date that year

We recorded "I've Got A Style" which was a part one and part two record. We were on the Ken Hawkins Show with the O'Jays who had a song out called "Choice". Ken was the biggest DJ in Cleveland at that time and he and WJMO was very supportive of Cleveland acts. WABQ also was very supportive of Hometown acts. I kind of disappointed that it's so hard to even get to talk to any
station in Cleveland today.

I'm currently trying to get an interview with WZAK with my new Time Machine CD. "I've got a Style" was a pretty good song but I think we needed a stronger song. It sounded like a Cleveland sound on a Manhattans real uptempo groove. I can't locate a copy of it to save my life. It was on Lira Records, produced by my choir teacher at East High Vernon Jones and the musicians were the O'Jays rhythm section Russell Evans(guitar),David Johnson(Bass) and Jerry Baxter(drums). It must have been meant for us to not make it off that song because we wouldn't have gone back to using the Imperial Wonders. We were greatly influenced by The O'Jays,The Temptations,The Manhattans,The Intruders,The
Artistics,Billy Stewart and it's funny that you mentioned it but we like "I Need You" and the flip side "I've Got To Keep Rolling Along" by The Vontastics.

A new friend of mine from Cleveland named Andrew Hamilton also mentioned The Vontastics "Rolling Along" the first time we had a long talk. It appears you and him are on a vibe with us on that group because not too many people have even heard of them.

We recorded "Just A Dream" and "Zip-A-Doe-Doo-Dah" in 1967 but, it was officially released in 1968. Lester wrote and arranged the vocals except for the Bongs which was part of our trademark taken from The Manhattans "I'm The One Love Forgot". We recorded "Trying To Got To You" in 1968 but it was released in 1969. We originally were on our way to the studio to record another song with "When I Fall In Love" but I had my guitar with me while we were waiting for Lester to get ready and Walter Chaney and I wrote "Trying To Get To You". Of course we put our little signature Bongs on the beginning and we went into the studio with Warren Lanier and showed him the song and he said we were doing that one instead of the one we were scheduled to do. Somehow all the imperial Wonders names wound up on the credits as writers.

I asked Bob Davis how did that happen and he said that Lester told him that we all wrote it. I told Bob that that was not the case but he said it was too late the records were pressed up. I am going to straighten out that mistake very soon and I am going to claim the publishing too because I have a copy of the original songwriters agreement with the publisher that says that if they did not report to us the results of the activities on the song that all of the right would revert back to the writers. It just so happens that they have not sent us one statement in over 30 years. These two songs did not sell very much I am told but, I have also bee told that these songs are out on compilation CDs. So I hear is "Turned Around Over You"on a compilation CD.

Maybe one day we will get our share of the revenues from these songs. Yes we met some big names that got even bigger like Charles Hatcher who became Famous as Edwin Starr. He and my brother Roland grew up together and my brother swears to this day that Edwin's last name was Hatchet not Hatcher. I might E-mail Edwin and ask him to clear this mystery up. We were on the show with a group from out of Detroit called Smoke, Heat and Fire who later the lead singer became The Undisputed Truth. We were on a show with Johnny Nash when he had out "Lets Move And Groove Together" before he became a Superstar with "I Can See Clearly Now". Things really started going wrong for us in 1970 when we did not wait for a chance to record with Gamble and Huff. The wrong people were making important decisions for us and some of us were still kids as far as business is concerned. As a matter of fact the fog is just lifting for me and I am farther ahead than the rest of my Imperial Buddies. Its funny to me to have people who know that they have taken our money from us call me and tell me that they want to get back together and try it again. What they mean is that they want to get credit for writing things that they didn't, they want to take credit for producing things that they didn't, they want us to go on tours and let them take our bank accounts and never giveus an accounting of where we stand with our royalties. Being uninformed and gullible is one thing but masochistic I am not. I told them to find some new young act to play their music games with because I need to hook up with someone thats connected not someone who wants to use me to help
them to get connected.

I'll be talking to you real soon Mike Al
Boyd over and out.

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